Did anyone read the second SUPERMAN 78 mini-series? Any good? Art looks pretty solid, it's got some Chris Sprouse vibes.
I paged through it.
Looked boring, didn't buy it.
Samesies
Oh, I'm surprised -- this particular one seems like it's right up your alley, it's Superman against a Soviet Metallo. It was like, "What if they made a Superman movie in the same vein as Rocky IV?" He even got the Russian citizens on his side a la Rocky.
I saw these at Target for $8 a pop last weekend and couldn't resist. These looks so 80s, right down to the sculpting. In retrospect, it's kind of shocking that they never put out a toyline based on these movies when you consider how popular the films were at the time. The first movie alone made $300m at the box office, which I think it something like $1.4 billion in today's dollars.
So I watched the 3-hour "Extended Edition" of SUPERMAN: THE MOVIE this past weekend. Well overdue, I bought it when it came out, back in... cripes, 2017! (Man, even worse than I thought!)
In any case, I have Superman fever and wanted a rewatch, so it made sense to watch the one that had content I've never seen before. I was enthralled. I've lost any ability to judge this movie objectively. Every scene is wildly entertaining to me, even the really boring parts, even in this 3-hour plus extended cut packed with filler like Otis wandering around the subway station. It's become more than just a Superman movie, it's become a time capsule of an idealized version of 70s New York City (despite being shot in England). The clothes, the cars, the way people talk, it's all very, very watchable to these old eyes.
I'm not sure what I can really say about it at this point -- it's probably my favorite movie of all time and the first one I have any memory of seeing (on VHS). We went to my dad's friend's place to see it and I still remember him saying, "Hey, we're going to watch the Superman movie" and me thinking, "Whoa, there's a Superman MOVIE?!" I must have been 6 or 7 at the time.
I also watched SUPERMAN II: THE DONNER CUT the next day. The first and last third of this cut are much preferable to me than the theatrical version, but Donner was too aggressive in trimming the Richard Lester material in the middle, which I feel you need for storytelling / pacing purposes. I think this would be the ultimate cut if you switch the scene where Superman's identity is revealed to Lois with the theatrical one (I like the Donner one but it's an audition tape and looks way out of place) and then put most of the stuff with the Kryptonians destroying the small town back in the film.
The one thing I'll say is that there doesn't seem to be a "perfect" cut of either two movie for my tastes. There was a lot of really good Hackman stuff in the Extended edition -- in particular, a scene where we explicitly see that Luthor and Tessmacher are a romantic couple and Superman saving her from Luthor -- that I wish they would have left in. I also think the original Superman could have used a "Donner Cut" as well where the movie ends on the originally intended cliffhanger, so you can watch both versions back-to-back as they originally were intended.
But that all said, I'm glad we got what we got. Looking back at these two films, it's even more insane that they made Superman III the way they did. You had these two incredibly successful Superman movies, both critically and commercially, and instead of trying to match the tone, feel, and verisimilitude of those huge money makers, they decide to lean into camp with Richard Pryor. It boggle the mind. Donner laid out the blueprint, you just had to follow it.
And hell, they laid out the blueprint in the first two seasons of the George Reeves show to boot. Just do it straight, no one wants to see Superman doing schtick.
Revisiting these movies always sends me down the fan edit rabbit hole... and man, this is a wild one. Someone combined all three Superman movies into a single movie! Insanity!
I wish you had commented on the individual episodes of Superboy Season 3. There are a few in particular that I was really curious to know your reaction!
I was going to get to those at some point, hence not bringing it up here until I was ready. But then, maybe I never will be, lol, and then time will pass and things will fall out of my brain. So let's do it here and now!
So over on FB, Rafael mentioned he enjoyed some episodes of the 1988 SUPERBOY TV series. It reminded me that I have the entire series on DVD and hadn't yet watched it for reasons I can't seem to recall -- I have a vague memory of trying some of season 1, but I can't even recall if that's accurate, so IDK. Anyway, with Superman fever in full swing, I decided to go ahead and watch some of this show, starting with Season 3 as recommended by Jason Doot, as the seasons before it are supposed to be tough to get through with the exception of a handful of episodes.
Overall thoughts -- this has become one of my favorite Superman things out there, blending together 80s / 90s nostalgia, classic Pre-Crisis Superman mythology, and my affection for B-movies with questionable special effects and acting.
A few years back, I lamented that I wish American live-action TV series of the time had the same ambition and guts of their Japanese counterparts -- they never let budgets and FX hold them back in Ultraman, Kamen Rider, Power Rangers, etc. If it didn't look great or awkward, so be it. We've got stories to tell and we're not going to be limited. And to me, why even do a show about a character as colorful and powerful as Superman if you're scared about that stuff to begin with? Well, I guess this was the show I was asking for the whole time, because it certainly isn't scared to go full "comic book".
While the special effects ae crude and at times embarrassingly bad, I actually do admire the willingness ton be so ambitious. It's fun to see a live-action TV series that doesn't play the superhero action as conservatively as most superhero shows of this time period. I love the George Reeves THE ADVENTURES OF SUPERMAN series, but it would have been cool to see his Superman take on more sci-fi and supervillain threats like Adam West did in the 60s. Even the show following Superboy, LOIS & CLARK, mostly played it safe as far as Superman battling supervillains and monsters.
With this show, the writers and producers have no such trepidation. In fact, I find this show to be more ambitious in its scope and usage of Superman mythology than the Christopher Reeve series. Space aliens, alternate dimensions, supervillains, robots, supernatural forces, demons, magic users -- nothing is off the table as it full embraces its comic book roots. Classic villains like Bizarro, Mr. Mxyzptlk, and Metallo appear and the show takes the liberty of creating all sorts of new ones as well. If only the Salkynds had this sort of courage in their theatrical releases.
Gerard Christopher is one of the best-cast Superman actors I can recall, lacking only the muscular physique. His acting isn't incredible by any stretch, but it's serviceable enough for the type of show they're doing. The real stand out is Lana played by Stacy Haiduk, who has probably taken the title of "most attractive Superman actress ever" from Teri Hatcher in my book. She's just absolutely stunning and her acting is mostly pretty good.
I guess the series setting changes every season, but in season 3, Clark and Lana are doing an internship with a small government office that investigates paranormal activity. If they ever wanted to ditch the news reporter angle, I think this would be the next best set-up for a Superman series. It's got an X-Files type set-up and easily facilitates the character investigating strange Twilight Zone / Star Trek phenomena on Earth.
Anyway, here are my thoughts on the episodes, rapid fire. I don't feel like doing a synopsis for every episode, I'm just posting my reactions, but thankfully there's Wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_S ... E2%80%9391)
S3 E1-2: The Bride of Bizarro
I wasn't overly impressed with the two-parter as a story as I was watching it, but in retrospect, it does feel like classic Superman action. Bizarro is presented in this series (from what I've seen) as an Incredible Hulk type -- good-hearted, but angry and lonely because humanity panics whenever they catch a glimpse of him -- which is an idea I've had in my head for a while, so it was great to see it realized. The actors playing Luthor and his girlfriend are great.
S3 E3: The Lair
Eh, pretty forgettable, but not overly terrible.
S3 E4: Neila
Still not overly impressed with the show at this point, but I liked that they brought in a Maxima type and got more ambitious than the previous episode with a super-powered rival. I wonder why they didn't actually use Maxima since this was basically the same thing -- Maxima first appeared in 1989, maybe the show was already filming the 1990 season at this point and it's coincidental?
S3 E5-6: Roads Not Taken
Here's where I really start getting into the show. This is basically an "Elseworlds" episode where Superboy travels into some alternate realities to save Luthor. He sees another version of himself who has broken his "no killing" rule and another who has taken over the Earth as a supreme dictator. Both roads lead to dystopia. It really felt like a Star Trek episode, which I like and think suits any televised version of the character, and showed the show wasn't going to "talk down" to kids, who were theoretically the target audience. It was also slightly darker than you'd expect from a kids show of the time, with weightier themes and darker story moments. While no graphic violence is shown, it is discussed -- one reality's Superboy describes cutting Lex in half with his heat vision while the fascist version clearly executes anyone who voices dissent.
S3 E7: Sons of Icarus
This one got me in the feels. A lowly janitor who has been looked down upon his entire life finds a way to fly and suffers the same fate as the title suggests. The final line was affecting -- "Just once... I wanted them to have to look up to see me."
S3 E8: Carnival
Another surprisingly dark episode. A traveling carnival is secretly run by a demon or the devil or some such -- he tempts people and if they give in, he adds them to his chest of souls. Superboy shows up and his pure-hearted soul is a trophy the demon desperately wants. While we can all predict that he can't corrupt Superman (unless directed by Zack Snyder), I was surprised that Superman wasn't able to save all the souls already captured. The show opened with a father of two, clearly struggling financially, being tempted with a wallet full of cash that someone dropped on the ground. When he decides to keep the money, he's taken, and we never see his rescued. We just assume his family will never see him again, wondering forever where he vanished to. Again, pretty dark for a goofy kids' series.\
S3 E9: Test of Time
A real highlight of the season. Another episode that has a Star Trek style premise and unfolds in much the same way -- strange and surreal phenomena encountered, then an investigation reveals the truth. At this point, you come to feel it's a damn shame this show doesn't get a full hour timeslot to really dive into these stories. But then, perhaps the shorter run time forces them to be as lean and economical with their stories as possible, adding punch and keeping the pace quick and lively.
Anyway, this is taking even longer than I expected and I have some real work to do. Doot, if you want me to talk about specific episodes, just lemme know which ones -- I'd rather just devote more time to those than writing about ones you might not care about.
All right, now I have read your reviews. I love that you came to enjoy the series.
My own experience with the show is that I would occasionally see episodes when I was a kid, and I was always impressed at how dark -- and occasionally creepy -- the show seemed. And Lex Luthor was genuinely a little bit scary at times.
The "Roads Not Taken" two-parter with the good Lex and the Super-dictator definitely went hard when I caught it as a kid. Since I didn't watch the show regularly (not sure if they kept switching the times or if I just was too dumb to remember to catch it each week), I only ever saw part two. As a kid it made me a little frustrated that I had missed part one. When I finally was able to watch Part One on the DVD set, it was quite satisfying. Quite.
There's another two-parter where I only caught part two, and it's another really dark one ... coming up in Season Four. Watch for it, True Believer!
And, coming up in my very next post ... a list of the other Season 3 episodes that I need to hear your thoughts on.
3.11 -- Superboy Lost. Is this the one where he tries to stop a meteor and he gets amnesia? This one was interesting, because there's a George Reeves episode with the exact same premise, as I recall.
3.15 -- A Day in the Double Life. I remember this one being fun, kind of almost "meta," just showing little snapshots of what it's like for Supermanboy, having to constantly switch between Clark and Supes. It was good, right?
3.16 -- Bodyswap. This one I caught as a kid, and I remember thinking that the ending was like, "Holy sh--!, how is he going to get out of this??" This one speaks to what you were talking about, with the show only being 30 minutes, not 60, so they have to keep things lean and mean. I really like how when the show starts, Superman and Lex have already switched bodies. There's no preamble or set-up for it, they just jump right in.
3.22 -- Mine Games. Lex and Superboy trapped underground together. Classic trope! And this one is written by the actor who played Lex, which I thought was pretty cool.
3.24 -- Standoff. This is the one where Clark has to change to Superboy but he can't get a moment alone, right? I loved the premise. I thought this was one of the most flat-out entertaining episodes.
3.25 - 3.26 -- The second use of the parallel reality machine, yes? Never saw these as a kid, but thought they were really swell. It was great to see more "multiverse" type stuff.
I have a pair of students that got hooked by the pilot of Smallville and want to dive into the series proper. The problem is Smallville is a decade long and chock full of mediocre to outright terrible episodes.
I did a little digging online and found this guide
Would you guys make any subtractions or additions to this list? There's always a chance that my students will want to jump off before the series ends or will want to skip to the end, so the more suggestions you can give me, the better. It's been a decade since I've seen anything but the pilot, which holds up remarkably well, so my memory is pretty sketchy in regards to specifics of the show.
Depends on what's most important: Following the important "continuity"/Smallville lore episodes? (i.e., This episode isn't great but it gets referenced a lot in the series so you probably shouldn't skip it) Seeing the episodes that feel most Superman-prologuey? (i.e., This episode introduces heat vision/Bizarro/The Fortress of Solitude!) Geeky DC universe stuff? (i.e., This episode introduces Green Arrow/Martian Manhunter/The JSA!) Or just good quality episodes? (i.e. You don't have to be a Smallville apologist like Doot to say, hey, that was a pretty good one!)
These four categories are not mutually exclusive, of course, but you need to have some criteria and priorities if you're knocking down the episode list by 75-80%
So tell me what you want and how many episodes you want the list to consist of, and I'll take care of you.
You can also borrow my episode guide if you like -- still a work in progress but at 300,000 words it is already a thing of beauty.
Or just good quality episodes? (i.e. You don't have to be a Smallville apologist like Doot to say, hey, that was a pretty good one!)
Well, before I make you type out some big long list, how about the absolute best 2-3 episodes in your opinion -- the ones you'd use to try to hook a viewer (outside of the pilot, which I have already seen).
To help you with criteria, I tend to like "Star Trek / Twilight Zone" episodes (though certainly not the only style) -- strange happening, investigate, learn / use something about human nature to resolve.
Also, character stuff that gets you in the feels. I know you tend to think I like slam-bang superhero action the best, and I certainly like it, but I only tend to like it when the FX budget is movie sized. But even then, it's not my favorite -- my favorite is the same as yours and anyone else, I like to become invested and care about a character.
Also, I'd actually be curious to see an episode that really captures what you like about Smallville. It's always struck me as strange to see Superman fans hold it up as a favorite adaptation because of the "no tights, no flights" rule, so I'd love to understand your perspective.
Also, character stuff that gets you in the feels. I know you tend to think I like slam-bang superhero action the best, and I certainly like it, but I only tend to like it when the FX budget is movie sized. But even then, it's not my favorite -- my favorite is the same as yours and anyone else, I like to become invested and care about a character.
So you like "feels" instead of action? What are you, a thirteen-year-old girl? I'm not sure "Smallville" is for you.
I kid, I kid. Here is a list of six from the early years. (Plus a seventh one, from the middle years.)
Back in the early days of the Smallville thread, I was always pimping for "Hourglass," an early Season 1 episode. Episode 6, I believe. I think it's just a good, solid standalone tale of a young Clark Kent, and I think it fits your criteria: Strange happenings, and a good character piece for both young Clark and young Lex. (And I just checked, this is indeed Episode 1.6)
1.11 "Hug". Kind of a simple premise. Villain can control people's actions once he makes physical contact with them. But I think it's pretty well executed here.
From Season 2, it's definitely a cliche to say this, but ... the episode "Rosetta," with Christopher Reeve as a guest-star. Hard to argue with that. It's 2.17.
Episode 3.5: "Perry." Great performance of Perry White by Michael McKean.
Episode 3.8: "Shattered." Not sure how this one would play if you haven't seen the stuff leading up to it, but it is a pretty good, intense sort of "thriller" episode. Basic premise: Lex goes crazy and paranoid.
Episode 3.16. "Crisis" Your mention of Trek/Twilight Zone type of episodes with strange happenings ... Made me realize that there aren't too many like that. But this one qualifies, I think. A little bit of time shenanigans.
Episode 5.7. "Splinter" The further you go in, the harder it is to find self-contained episodes. This one has some continuity attached, but I think it's a standout, quality episode. Basic premise: Clark Kent ... goes crazy and paranoid. Hmm, maybe it's me, maybe I just like that trope.
Rafael wrote this very interesting, very well-researched article on the history of the Superman symbol. And then at the end, he thanks Ocean Doot... but for what? WHAT?!?!
Quote:
The Symbol of Superman: A History
It is perhaps one of the most recognizable symbols on the planet: a pentagon, usually yellow, with a stylized “S” in the center. Although it did not appear in this form from the beginning, the “S” has always been present on the chest of the character created by Jerry Siegel and Joe Shuster. Since then, its meaning, origin, and even its connection to the name “Superman” and the costume itself has changed over time. On some occasions, the emblem’s existence has even preceded the public adoption of the name by our esteemed reporter from Metropolis.
Broadly speaking, the symbol’s origin falls into two main categories: Earth-based and Kryptonian, though some stories across various media blend both approaches, while others ascribe to it more metaphysical meanings. Let us begin with the terrestrial origins...
I kid, I kid. Here is a list of six from the early years. (Plus a seventh one, from the middle years.)
Back in the early days of the Smallville thread, I was always pimping for "Hourglass," an early Season 1 episode. Episode 6, I believe. I think it's just a good, solid standalone tale of a young Clark Kent, and I think it fits your criteria: Strange happenings, and a good character piece for both young Clark and young Lex. (And I just checked, this is indeed Episode 1.6)
1.11 "Hug". Kind of a simple premise. Villain can control people's actions once he makes physical contact with them. But I think it's pretty well executed here.
From Season 2, it's definitely a cliche to say this, but ... the episode "Rosetta," with Christopher Reeve as a guest-star. Hard to argue with that. It's 2.17.
Episode 3.5: "Perry." Great performance of Perry White by Michael McKean.
Episode 3.8: "Shattered." Not sure how this one would play if you haven't seen the stuff leading up to it, but it is a pretty good, intense sort of "thriller" episode. Basic premise: Lex goes crazy and paranoid.
Episode 3.16. "Crisis" Your mention of Trek/Twilight Zone type of episodes with strange happenings ... Made me realize that there aren't too many like that. But this one qualifies, I think. A little bit of time shenanigans.
Episode 5.7. "Splinter" The further you go in, the harder it is to find self-contained episodes. This one has some continuity attached, but I think it's a standout, quality episode. Basic premise: Clark Kent ... goes crazy and paranoid. Hmm, maybe it's me, maybe I just like that trope.
Oh hey, I somehow missed this response! Now it's my turn to thank the Dootster.
Just wanted to post I've been enjoying the new Superman Unlimited title written by Dan Slott. A very clear effort to have a Silver Age Superman feel, contained with no cords over, and one-and-done A stories. Check it out if you are interested.
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